David Willford
Friday, I had the opportunity to talk with Bellator fighter Emmanuel “El Matador” Sanchez. He is set to fight on the main card of Bellator 149 on February 19th against UFC veteran Daniel Pineda. Sanchez has a pro record of 12-2 and fights in the featherweight division, training out of Roufusport in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, The 25 year old began his pro career in 2011 and has been in Bellator since 2014. Normally, the interview would lead to a short profile piece, using selected quotes from the fighter, but Sanchez was so enthusiastic and forthcoming that I thought it better to just include the entire transcript and let his answers speak for themselves. Dave Willford: Are you looking forward to the warmer Houston weather? Emmanuel Sanchez: Absolutely. Compared to this weather that I’m dealing with, I can’t wait for sunshine, shorts and sandals. DW: Speaking of Houston, you’re going to be fighting Daniel Pineda, who is from Houston. Does the crowd pulling for a local favorite add any pressure for you? ES: Not at all, sir. I’m used to being the enemy. I’m going into enemy territory; it’s his territory. Other than my fights in Milwaukee, I’ve never had anybody really cheer for me. But I’m used to the boos. I have thick skin, and I’m ready for it, but once I go out and they see me fight, see me compete and do my job, their fans often become my fans.
DW: Pineda has a lot of experience and you’re still relatively young. Have you watched his fights and think you see anything that you can exploit?
ES: Absolutely. I’ve seen all his fights in the UFC, and recent fights. He does have a lot of experience, he does bring a lot to the table. But I believe I have a better fight IQ, and better generals in my corner - my fight coaches, teammates, everything - so they all play a factor when it comes time on the night of the fight. He’s very skilled. I respect him. I respect what he’s done, but I’m looking to take him out. DW: Last night I re-watched your last few fights, and I was kind of struck by the pace and the work rate that you kept up. Is that a conscious decision - part of a strategy by you - or is it hard-wired into your personality? ES: Both. Sure, I’d say it’s to go out there and get the win and let the judges know that I’m always looking to finish, I’m always looking to - this is the point of why we’re hitting - inflict pain and cause damage. That’s the only way you can win. In that sense, that’s what I get from grappling as well, I’m showing that I’m not just conceding that I got taken down, or at the end of the fight “Oh, I’m in a position I don’t want to be in. This is the end.” Instead, it’s just the beginning. Everywhere, no matter where I’m at, I’m always, “I can fight everywhere.” DW: Tied in with that, coming off two split decisions, does finishing the fight become more important to you after that? ES: Absolutely, because I had opportunities to finish both fights, one in the first and one in the second, and you know I didn’t get it. Unfortunate, but you live and you learn. I have to take it well, because that’s a win, and that’s all that matters. Also, I pride myself on being a finisher, and I’m very hard on myself. I’m on a winning streak, but I want the finish. That’s the kind of results I want to see on my statistics.
DW: You’ve taken some fairly important fights on short notice. Do you see that as an advantage for you, or a disadvantage?
ES: I’d say an advantage, because it goes to prove that I’m always ready. I feel that myself, as a Bellator employed fighter, that they can rely on me. If I’m a go-to guy, and have the ability to say “yes”, then great. I feel that it’s something good to have. Because you never know. Whether it’s for a title, or for a main event, or some other big fight: “Hey, we need someone to cover. Can you do it? Yes or no.” You have to have the ability to say “Yes.” I’m always training. I’m hungry and I’m always ready. It’s a great feeling to have. DW: I’ve noticed that you’ve emphasized the importance of hard work in your career. I assume you adhere to the thought that fights are won or lost in training. Do you train and game plan for a specific fighter, or just work to perfect your own technique? ES: I’m always working to perfect my craft. New tools, more knowledge, and just everything. Striking, wrestling, jiu jitsu. But even if it’s to train a single-leg or a jab that I’ve done a million times, it’s like the Bruce Lee saying, “Fear the man who has done one technique ten thousand times, not the man who has ten thousand techniques.” Each and every little thing I do, I want to perfect. I want to keep getting it down right, because essentially that’s what a Black Belt is. It’s someone who has done it over and over and over again. If Michael Jordan never stopped shooting free throws, then I’m never going to stop what I do. DW: Also, with the emphasis on hard work, does over-training ever become an issue? ES: Slightly. You know, I feel it, even at my young age. I’m not trying to prove to myself, “Oh. I’m tough.” Given the sport we’re in, people already believe in themselves. We already know that there’s nothing to prove. We have to train hard, we have to take care of ourselves, our body is our temple. You need to train and also rest. So we’ll have it when we need it for what we love to do. So, I like to work very, very hard so that I earn my rest.
DW: Along with the work ethic, you had a pretty busy year last year in 2015. Do you feel that fighting often helps you improve overall?
ES: Yes. As my coach would say to me, fighting is easy for me, it’s just like walking. The lights, the media, the attention, his hometown, my hometown, wherever it is, none of that matters to me. If it’s a fight, it’s fifteen minutes to prove why I’m better than this guy and I can’t wait to go do it. I’ve worked very hard for it, I’ve earned it. Just like when you’re a kid. You’ve studied hard, you’ve worked hard, and you’ll pass with flying colors. DW: I’ve noticed on your social media accounts that you post a lot of motivational and inspirational quotes. Is that part of your mental training, and what other methods help you prepare mentally for a fight? ES: Yes, I would say. Because we all need that. We all need that boost, we’re human. I believe you’re a liar if you say that you don’t, because it’s very difficult to wake up, and it’s very repetitive as well, with the training that we do and the way that we feel exhausted, hungry, tired, sore, beaten, bruised up. We all need something that gives us that boost to be able to say “OK, forget whatever stress or issues I have going on, and let’s go out there and do what needs to get done, and we’ll worry about the rest when that comes.” That’s how I feel training is therapeutic for me, as well. I leave it all outside the gym door when I enter. When I enter, training is all that I’m thinking about. I’m glad nothing has ever gotten too much in my head that’s distracted me from my training. I get to go out and I’m at peace, and when I’m done then I’ll worry about whatever I need to worry about. It’s nice to always be motivated and inspired by other people to go out and do what you want to do. DW: I noticed also that you posted last year that it was the first year you had been able to train full-time. Did you see a marked improvement when you were able to devote yourself to the sport full-time? ES: Absolutely. Prior to that I had a full-time job. I was still able to train every day, but I was lacking my sleep. I worked third shift, so I was not sleeping and resting as much as I needed and would have liked to. When you’re young, you can get away with it, but I knew I couldn’t do that forever. It was a risk. I knew once my time came and the opportunity arose, I said, “OK, I think I’m ready to go and commit to this full-time now.” It’s been a blessing ever since, and I’m very thankful and fortunate that I’ve had this opportunity to do what I love every day.
DW: Along with the jumping to full time, do you see any particular areas that the improvement has come faster in?
ES: Yes, in everything. I get to take more classes. Obviously, not every time we train. Some people may think it’s like a Rocky montage or a Gatorade commercial, where we’re just out there lifting crazy weights, and running sprints, we’re tired... No. Really, it’s I get to mix up practice. I get to train my wrestling, my jiu jitsu, my striking. Then in the night time, I get to do more. I do pad work, I take other classes with my coaches. Whether it would be wrestling, jiu jitsu, or striking, I get to do more of that throughout the week. And even if it’s only for an hour or two, an hour and a half, it’s still more work that I got to put in. Mental training, and just being there, having that knowledge, having those tools. I’m always in the gym, and it’s always fun learning. DW: Going back to the beginning, what drew you in to mixed martial arts? You mentioned that in high school you watched a lot of tapes that you had recorded, and that you had wrestled some. What made you think, “Yeah, this is what I want to do.”? ES: I’d have to say my biggest inspiration was Georges St. Pierre. A man who had never wrestled, came from traditional martial arts, was bullied as a kid, and was able to go oit and do everything that he has done. That’s what inspired me the most. He’s very humble, he came from humble beginnings, and had to work all the way until he got to the top. I just saw myself being able to do those same things. And even if I couldn’t, well, at least I could say “You know what? I attempted it.” I could happily say, “At least I attempted it and made something happen.” I attempted it, and now I’m a professional fighter. I get to do this for a living, and that’s a very huge blessing in my life, and something I’m very thankful for. DW: Tied in with that, you’re still young - 25 years old. Was there a point, whether it’s your first pro fight, your first Bellator fight, or whatever, when you thought to yourself, “Yeah, I’m not a novice any more. I’m good at this, and this is what I’m here to do.”? ES: Every fight. I’d have to say every fight, since my first amateur fight, my first professional fight. Every time I’m under those lights, it’s just like, “Oh, man, I’m at home. All my peeps! This is what I was made for.” What a great gift that is, that I get to go out and do what I love to do. Some may think, “Ah, you’re crazy.” or “Why would you want to do that?” I know. I understand the risks. I wish no ill will toward my opponents, or any mixed martial artist. The passing of Kevin Randleman was very heartbreaking to hear yesterday. Retired or current, any fighter I have the utmost respect for. It’s something that’s very great, and I’m very happy to be in this mixed martial arts world. Manny “Matador" Sanchez head kick setup!
DW: If I’m not mistaken, you joined Roufusport right around the time you signed with Bellator, and before that you didn’t have nearly as much structure in your training. How has being with the team helped your progress?
ES: Very good. As you were saying, all my amateur and professional fights, I had traveled a lot to train but I never had a set coach. I really didn’t. I had people in my corner and around me helping me out or telling me what to do, or what I should do in someone’s opinion. I had to get all my professional fights by myself, until when I was in RFA in 2013 when I started training with Duke Roufus full-time. Ever since then it’s been a blessing, because I have, in my opinion, the nest teammates in the world. We’ve got some of the top guys in the UFC, in One FC, and al over the world, and I’ve got some of the best coaches. I’ve got five or six different coaches. Two of them are head coaches, obviously Duke Roufus and Scott Cushman, and then my jiu jitsu coach Daniel Wanderley. But I have many other experienced coaches that help out with our MMA program and our MMA fighters that are here in the gym. It’s great to have all these different insights to help me out to better myself as a martial artist. DW: Who are your main training partners there at Roufusport? ES: Obviously, we have the superstars, the Pettis brothers. They’ve been my main training partners. We have a lot of guys who aren’t signed yet, but they’re on their way up. Raufeon Stots, man, he’s a stud. He’s a two-time NCAA Division II national champion wrestler. He’s undefeated right now, and he just fought at Victory Fighting Championship, and that was on UFC Fight Pass. Right now, he’s out main 135-pounder, and he’ll probably be the next one to be fighting for the UFC. He’s definitely a champ in the making right now. We have not many in my weight class, but they’re up and coming. We have many up and coming guys who fight for King of the Cage and other promotions. They’re making their names. But obviously you have the UFC stars, who are what I have right now for my training partners. DW: It’s often heard that you learn more from your defeats than from your victories. Now, you’ve only lost twice as a pro so far. What have you learned from those? ES: Never take a fight outside your weight class, unless it’s for a world title or a lot of money. My first professional defeat, like I was saying earlier, was without Duke Roufus, with no coaches. I took that fight at two weight classes above what I’m at right now, against a much better wrestler. So that’s obviously not encouraged, not advised. I still wholeheartedly believe that I’m better than him, but he was able to defeat me in the eyes of the judges. That was a mistake on my part for fighting outside of my weight and wanting to prove that I was better than that man. You live and you learn. What I learned from the Pat Curran fight, my one loss since being with Duke Roufus, was really difficult because I had been training with Pat Curran literally weeks before I got the call to fight him. Duke called me and said, “Hey, you want to fight Pat Curran?” And I’m like, “Oh, my goodness. How did this happen? Wow.” On short notice and everything. I had to think about it, but it was just too big of an opportunity to pass up. Who knows what would have happened if I has said “No.”? Who knows if I would have fought two other times after that last year? It was a blessing in disguise. I feel I’ve learned, and I’ll make my way back. DW: I saw you mention after the Curran fight that you were overly focused on beating him in the standup. Have you been working more on how to adapt and improvise as the flow of the fight changes? ES: Yes, absolutely. Because it’s mixed martial arts. We pride ourselves as fighters, but can get a little arrogant. Saying, “Oh, this guy has no knockout power. I’m going to go knock him out.” Or, “He has no wrestling. I can take him down easy, and he’s not going to take me down.” But this is mixed martial arts. We have to be honest and real with ourselves that anyone can take you down and anyone can knock you out. That’s the truth about it. I know just yesterday as well was the anniversary of Buster Douglas knocking out Mike Tyson. No one ever, ever, believed that would happen. And it did. No one believed Holly Holm would take out Ronda Rousey. But she did. They’re incredible feats, but that’s just the truth about it, that we're all just human beings and we all can be beaten on any given day. For me, it’s definitely go out and use all my tools, all my weapons. I’ve showcased a little bit in my fights that I obviously like to keep it standing, but I love to fight everywhere. Standing, on the ground, on the cage, clinch work. I like fighting everywhere. I have to go out there and use all of my weapons instead of just one. DW: Getting back to the Pineda fight, how do you see that one going, as far as stylistically? ES: He’s very aggressive. As we were saying earlier, he’s finished all of his professional fights. He’s got a lot of experience. I believe it’s kind of a double-edged sword, for him. Yes, he’s finished all of his fights, but he’s also been finished many times in his career, so he’s left those openings, and I believe I can capitalize on those openings. I have a better fight IQ. I’ve seen that even in his losses by decision in the UFC. They were good and he had his moments, but I know where I can capitalize and do the exact same things, if not worse. I’m looking to go out there and showcase it all. Showcase all the weapons, not just “Oh, hey, I need to avoid this guy’s ground game, or this guy’s punching power.” I need to go and out-MMA this guy, to defeat him everywhere. DW: I like that you don’t engage in trash talking your opponents and try to belittle them. With you coming as a GSP fan, that makes sense, but is it also something that’s part of your upbringing and personality naturally? ES: Yes. I wouldn’t say I grew up in a rough neighborhood, but there’s trouble everywhere you go. I was bullied a little bit and even to this day when I see kids behave the way they do, or adults even, just trying to pick a fight with someone, I think “Why do we need to bring someone’s mother into this conversation?” or go and start cursing? A dog is going to bark. That’s all they do is bark. They don’t bite. They bark at you and nothing happens, you know what I mean? Well, I fight. If we’re going to go and we’re going to fight. I do my talking in the octagon. The talk is cheap, and the fists are real. That’s the way I feel. I’ve always seen myself as a quiet humble warrior. What’s the need to go and say things about my opponents? I know, like I was saying earlier, that they have the potential to beat me. Anyone does, anyone on any given day. I’m going to ahead and I’m going to take care of business, fight my fight and see what happens. DW: Along with that, as an up and coming fighter, do you give a lot of conscious thought to being a role model both inside and outside the cage? ES: Yes. As a hispanic immigrant, that’s the way I see myself. My family, we’ve been in the United States over twenty years now, and we are all citizens. It’s great, because whether there are other children now, born in Mexico or here, it’s still something that I have to live for. For people who do not have documentation yet, or who had the same upbringing as I did. It’s difficult to be a product of immigrants here and then being able to go to school and get your education, bettering yourself in your future and your life. That’s something every human being should want to do. Whether they’re from South of the border, from Poland, or from Russia, wherever they come from, coming here and making a home in the United States is something great. We’re really truly living and pursuing the American Dream. To start a business, to start a life, to better our own lives and the lives of the generations after us. That’s something that I’m looking to do as well, being the Oscar De La Hoya of mixed martial arts. DW: Now if I’m not mistaken, this is the last fight on your current Bellator contract. Assuming you get the win against Pineda, what do you see in the immediate future, and also what are your most important long-term goals? ES: Long-term goals? Obviously, to be a champion. That’s the only reason why I got into this sport, to be a champion. Who can deny it? It’s great to make tons of money, fight on TV and have the world see what you can do, but the biggest thing for me was always to be a champion. As a prize fighter, that’s having my trophy. Having that belt right up on my wall. If I have a house some day, having these prizes, have that belt hanging above my fireplace, or have my mom being able to take a picture with it. That’s my dream right there. Being a champion. Whether the UFC wants me, or Bellator wants to re-sign me. I’ve always had the plan, like we were talking about earlier, of win your fights and everything else will take care of itself. I just want to go out and put on exciting performances, and whoever wants me, wherever I can make an impact and pursue my dream and do what I love for a living, I’m happy. DW: Associated with that, do you keep an eye on featherweights in other organizations that you might have to fight someday? Is there a fight that you want in particular? ES: I believe it was September of 2014, or whenever that last fight was, after Scott Coker took over Bellator, Pat Curran and Pitbull were fighting, and I remember tweeting that night as I was watching the fight “I’m watching these guys closely.” And look what happened. I ended up fighting Curran just a year later. It could have been Pitbull, though. You never know. I enjoy watching featherweights fight, whether it’s UFC, One FC, King of the Cage, or RFA. It’s interesting. This will be the fifth former champion that I’ve fought. Daniel Pineda fought in Legacy for AXS TV, Justin Lawrence was RFA, Pat Curran was Bellator, and Henry Corrales was King of the Cage, so this is another champion that I get to have under my belt. DW: Given some of the other fights on the main card, Bellator 149 has the possibility of drawing more than the usual number of casual fans. Do you see that as an opportunity for you to put on an especially good fight, get eyes watching you and advance your career? ES: Absolutely. As soon as that fight was announced between Royce Gracie and Ken Shamrock, I knew I wanted to be on that card. You miss 100% l of the shots that you don’t take, as they say. Do you know what I mean? If there is an opportunity like that, you have to have the opportunity to say “Yes.” I knew right away when I got the call to fight Justin Lawrence, “Wow, not only do I get the opportunity to fill in and fight Pat Curran, but now I get to fill in for Pat Curran.” Because that wasn’t supposed to be me. What a great opportunity. That’s the way the stars aligned. When that fight between Royce Gracie and Ken Shamrock was announced, Duke Roufus texted me saying, “Hey, we’ve got February 19th in Houston, Texas.” I truly believe in destiny, I believe in hard work, and when the stars aligned, I was ready to go out and take the shot. DW: As a young fighter, how important are good sponsors to you in helping you move up the ladder? ES: I believe it’s very important. But like I was saying earlier, I’m no complainer, just an entertainer. Win your fights and everything will take care of itself. My management is good. I never would have dreamed of having any of the things I have now, but I do. I believe I’m taken care of with everything. Would it be nice to have Nike, and Gatorade, and Under Armour, and all this other stuff? Yes, it would be, or exclusively signed with Reebok like my teammate Anthony Pettis. But I’m not, and to me it’s no big deal. I have things that supply my training, they show their support to me. Like Iowa Bison, supplies bison meat so I have them on my shorts, Grit Mouthguards made my mouthpiece for me for free, so I get to have them on my shorts. It’s nice. As I was saying earlier, would it be nice to have someone who can provide me with money? Yes, but my winning bonus for me is winning my fight. It’s good to have this support from all these local people, and I’m able to showcase them all on my shorts and on my banner on live television, and go out and win for them. DW: And the last question from me. You seem to be more of a mixed martial artist, in that you don’t have a particular base. You aren’t coming in as a karate guy, or strictly a wrestler. Do you see that as an advantage that you came into the sport as a well-rounded fighter, or do you think that having a strong base in one area would have helped you earlier in your career? ES: I did wrestle as a kid, but not all the way up to the high school/college level like I would have liked to. But I think that’s good, because I probably would have been a little more hard nosed, and had a big head, thinking “Oh, I’m a good wrestler, I can just wrestle people, and they can’t take me down.” When MMA first started out, that’s how a lot of wrestlers had that mentality, that “All I have to do is wrestle, and learn any of the other arts.” And we’ve seen the best wrestler in MMA, Georges St. Pierre, he came from Karate. I think it’s good, that I’ve been able to learn all these arts together, as opposed to just coming from one strict discipline. I got my black belt in Karate under Duke Roufus, I have my purple belt in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu under Daniel Wanderley, and in the kickboxing program, I’m also a black belt under Duke Roufus. It’s really good that I have all these different disciplines that I’m able to mold all into one as a mixed martial artist. And training with Ben Askren for my wrestling, that just makes me more and more dangerous. I come from the Midwest, where it’s a dime a dozen. We breed wrestlers here. Cauliflower ears is a normal thing. We have a lot of Iowa guys, Wisconsin guys, Nebraska, Illinois. We have some hard-nosed guys here. But it’s good, because they all wrestle very differently. So that’s also a very good thing. I appreciate the support of all these different types of wrestlers, types of jiu jitsi guys, types of strikers, that I get to work with. DW: Thanks a lot for your time doing the interview, and good luck in your fight next week. |
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